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化工的Phd vs Financial Engineering得master,大家给出出主意

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06-02-07 17:48操作
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化工的Phd vs Financial Engineering得master,大家给出出主意

化工的Phd读的不爽,research没有进展,还有一年就毕业了,纯粹是混个phd头衔,没打算将来还从事这一行。


转行作quant是我的career goal. 虽然我有一些这方面的背景,但是没有学位。听说wall street 是什么专业都要得,真的是这样子吗?


这里finance的姐妹挺多的,麻烦大家帮我看看转个Financial Engineering得master 我是不是该出手了?


主要问题有:


1) finance这一行对Phd的需求量 是不是远远不如master呢?


2) 这一行知有个master学位办绿卡容易吗?


大家给出出主意吧,跪谢了!!!

[em09][em09][em09]
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06-02-07 17:52操作
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mm要是top10学校的化工phD,支持你转行做quant。。。

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06-02-07 18:18操作
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mm既然是要去做quant, 有个PhD是很必要的, 很多都说要求必须是math, physics, statistics, EE or other solid science phd..... 他们看中的是你受过phd的这个training.....你还有一年就要拿到phD了,你也很确定自己的兴趣不在此,我要是你,就从现在开始自学所有quant相关的知识,一边做完这个phd....等你毕业的时候或毕业前就开始找这方面的位置。不在乎你有没有FE的学位,如果你知识过硬,headhunter自然会给你找到interview

再去读个finanical engineering的master一来开销太大,二来又要耽误你至少1年的时间,三来你之前付出的phd的辛苦也白费了。。。。

其实我跟mm的处境很像,不过我一直很拖拉,一直到毕业了也没有看多少quant方面的书,现在开始找这方面的工作很吃力。不过我给自己一年的时间,如果还不成的话,我想也会去考虑读个financial engineering的master........
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Quant有多难申请?工作会有多累?从来没有想过这些问题。谢谢谢谢


top 10学校是不是特别重要?编程背景和market背景有多重要呢?


[em27][em27][em27][em27]
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06-02-07 19:04操作
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以下是引用dormouse在2006-2-7 17:52:00的发言:
mm要是top10学校的化工phD,支持你转行做quant。。。



top 10 是指专业排名还是学校的整体排名?


化工phd跟quant有什么关系呢?人家为什么会招专业背景完全不相干的人呢?好奇。我也有心转行。

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06-02-07 19:32操作
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以下是引用mingm在2006-2-7 19:04:00的发言:


top 10 是指专业排名还是学校的整体排名?


化工phd跟quant有什么关系呢?人家为什么会招专业背景完全不相干的人呢?好奇。我也有心转行。





学校的整体排名


As long as you are smart and have solid quantitative background, you can build models for them. That is why they want grads from top 10 schools, otherwise it is really hard to know if you are excellent.


[此贴子已经被作者于2006-2-10 3:43:32编辑过]

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06-02-07 20:37操作
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What is quant?
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我觉得financial engineering是个很好的专业, 我个人还是很喜欢的, 可惜就是我文科出身, 数学计算机底子不好,都是现学的, 只能应付课程了, 找工作时我不敢找quant, 避开了对数学和编程要求较高的工作, 理工科出身的学起来应该更容易, 找工作范围肯定也更大!!如果能找到免学费的, 强烈推荐!! 自己付学费的话, 真是有点贵~~
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06-02-07 20:54操作
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转载一篇关于quant的文章。。。。。

ON BECOMING A QUANT (MARK JOSHI)

What does a quant do?
A quant designs and implements mathematical models for the pricing of derivatives.
What sorts of quants are there?
(1) Front oce/desk quant
(2) Model validating quant
(3) Research quant
(4) Quant developer

A desk quant implements pricing models directly used by traders.
Main plusses close to the money and opportunities to move into trading.
Minuses can be stressful and depending on the outfit may not involve
much research.

A model validation quant independently implements pricing models
in order to check that front oce models are correct. Plusses more
relaxed, less stressful. Minusses model validation teams can be uninspired
and far from the money.

Research quant tries to invent new pricing approaches and sometimes
carries out blue-sky research. Plusses it’s interesting and you learn a
lot more. Minusses sometimes hard to justify your existence.

Quant developer – a glorified programmer but well-paid and easy to find a job.
All forms of quants spend a large amount (i.e. more than half) their
time programming. However, implementing new models is interesting
in itself. The standard programming approach is object-oriented C++.
A wannabe quant must learn C++.

In the UK standard sources for job adverts are www.jobserve.com
search under ”quant”, the FT appointments section on a Thursday,
and www.wilmott.com has a jobs board. A lot of adverts are from
recruitment consultants rather than from banks. It’s important to
realize that the job may not even exist – the consultant wants to get
decent candidates that he can then try to place them in banks. The
consultant gets a commission from the bank if he can place you. They
tend to have short attention spans. If you do well at the first couple of
interviews then they will work hard to get you a good job but if you
don’t they will quickly lose interest. Also, be aware their agenda is to
get a good commission rather than to help you so they will push you
at jobs on that basis.

In fact, going via a recruitment consultant is the standard way to
get a job. Quants are generally not hired as a part of the on campus
recruitment process but instead hired as they are needed by the team.
Because of this it’s not a great idea to start applying a long time before
you want to start. Obviously personal contacts should be exploited
as much as possible. Banks tend not to be into paying expenses for
interviews. One therefore needs to go to London or New York and
attempt to get as many interviews as possible as quickly as possible.

What should one learn? Standard books are
• Hull - Options future and other derivatives – comprehensive
but low level mathematically and can be frustrating for pure
mathematicians
• Baxter and Rennie – accessible introduction to martingale approach
but oriented towards theory rather than practicalitues
• Wilmott (Derivatives) – good on the PDE approach but not so
good on other approaches.

My book will be published in early 2003 and I like it, of course.
Stochastic calculus is useful but not as important as it at first appears.
Standard texts are Oksendal, and Karatzas and Shreve. It’s
hard to find the time to pick it up on the job so it’s worth learning in
advance. It’s also worth spending some time going over basic probability
theory – eg Chung’s books.

Interviewers tend to care more about understanding the basics well
than on knowing a lot. It’s also important to demonstrate genuine
interest in the field. Read the Economist and the FT or Wall Street
Journal comprehensively. It’s not unusual to ask basic calculus or analysis
questions e.g. what is the integral of log x. Asking for a derivation
of the Black-Scholes equation is very common too. They always ask
you to explain your thesis so be prepared to be able to do this.

Generally, a PhD (or almost a PhD) is a necessity to get a quant
job. I would advise against starting before it’s awarded as it tends to
be hard to get it done whilst doing a busy job.
The main challenge for a pure mathematician is to be able to get
one’s hands dirty and learning to be more focussed on getting numeric
results than on fancy theories. The main way to do this is to implement
pricing models for practice. If this doesn’t appeal you aren’t suited to
being a quant. There are quite a few ex-pure mathematicians working
in the city so it can certainly be done but there is some prejudice
towards applied maths and physics people.

How much does a quant earn? A quant with no experience will
generally get between 35 and 50k pounds. This will generally go up
fairly rapidly. Bonuses are generally a large component of total salary.
How hard does a quant work? This varies a lot. At RBS we get in
between 8.30 and 9 and go home around 6pm. The pressure varies.
Some of the American banks expect much longer hours. Wall St tends
to be more demanding than the City. In London 5 to 6 weeks holidays
is standard. In the US 2 to 3 is standard.

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06-02-07 20:57操作
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学费实在是贵阿。。。不过我刚听说,这部分是可以抵税的。比方说如果你家LD已经工作了,就可以考虑去自费念书(不然也得交掉2,3万的税)。。。
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06-02-07 21:37操作
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英国人一年有五六个礼拜的假期,羡慕
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06-02-07 22:01操作
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编程背景和market背景有多重要呢?对于fresh Ph.D. Quant有多难申请?今天实在是好奇阿。[em27][em27][em27][em27][em27]
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06-02-07 22:14操作
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建议sally_chr mm去这个网站看看: http://www.quantfinancejob.com/quantative-finance-guides.html
上面有特别详细的介绍

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06-02-07 23:43操作
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wall street 特别势力--很看中学校牌子。。。
要是top10的学校,他们大概就不care你的专业了
我觉得数学物理phd做比较有优势
大部分的quant都是phD
math finance或者financial engineering的master要做quant不容易
一般都是analyst。。。

做quant其实很boring的
成天写code做model
而且工作时间长
不过工资比较高。。。
要是在一个赚钱的组bonus会是base的好几倍

[em08]

btw。。。我不是做这一行的。。。呵呵
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06-02-07 23:48操作
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以下是引用little_chervil在2006-2-7 18:18:00的发言:
mm既然是要去做quant, 有个PhD是很必要的, 很多都说要求必须是math, physics, statistics, EE or other solid science phd..... 他们看中的是你受过phd的这个training.....你还有一年就要拿到phD了,你也很确定自己的兴趣不在此,我要是你,就从现在开始自学所有quant相关的知识,一边做完这个phd....等你毕业的时候或毕业前就开始找这方面的位置。不在乎你有没有FE的学位,如果你知识过硬,headhunter自然会给你找到interview

再去读个finanical engineering的master一来开销太大,二来又要耽误你至少1年的时间,三来你之前付出的phd的辛苦也白费了。。。。

其实我跟mm的处境很像,不过我一直很拖拉,一直到毕业了也没有看多少quant方面的书,现在开始找这方面的工作很吃力。不过我给自己一年的时间,如果还不成的话,我想也会去考虑读个financial engineering的master........
mm加油。。。我觉得特意去读一个finacial engineering没有必要。。。关键是能应付interview就行。。。
数学 编程 统计 econometrics。。。。

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06-02-08 01:58操作
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以下是引用little_chervil在2006-2-7 22:14:00的发言:
建议sally_chr mm去这个网站看看: http://www.quantfinancejob.com/quantative-finance-guides.html
上面有特别详细的介绍


谢谢谢谢[em25][em25]今天对这个突然长草

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06-02-08 17:34操作
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以下是引用飞飞公主在2006-2-7 20:48:00的发言:
我觉得financial engineering是个很好的专业, 我个人还是很喜欢的, 可惜就是我文科出身, 数学计算机底子不好,都是现学的, 只能应付课程了, 找工作时我不敢找quant, 避开了对数学和编程要求较高的工作, 理工科出身的学起来应该更容易, 找工作范围肯定也更大!!如果能找到免学费的, 强烈推荐!! 自己付学费的话, 真是有点贵~~

financial engineering出来都干些什么样的工作?好找工作吗?我都动心了。

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06-02-08 17:37操作
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以下是引用factor在2006-2-7 19:32:00的发言:



top 10 是指专业排名还是学校的整体排名?


化工phd跟quant有什么关系呢?人家为什么会招专业背景完全不相干的人呢?好奇。我也有心转行。




专业排名


As long as you are smart and have solid quantitative background, you can build models for them. That is why they want grads from top 10 schools, otherwise it is really hard to know if you are excellent.



我还以为一般人只看学校的整体排名呢,尤其是华尔街, 估计只认常春藤的学校。工程的top 10的学校整体排名几乎都进不了top 10。


我对工程厌倦了, 虽然拿了个工程top 10 school的phd, 可是不想做类似的工作, 考虑改行。可是又不想重新读学位, 30左右的人了。

[em10]
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06-02-08 18:47操作
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以下是引用dormouse在2006-2-7 17:52:00的发言:
mm要是top10学校的化工phD,支持你转行做quant。。。


谢谢mm的支持,我们学校是Ivy League,但是常青藤的phd又怎么样呢?也不对口。。。。

[em03][em03][em03][em03]
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06-02-08 18:50操作
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以下是引用little_chervil在2006-2-7 18:18:00的发言:
mm既然是要去做quant, 有个PhD是很必要的, 很多都说要求必须是math, physics, statistics, EE or other solid science phd..... 他们看中的是你受过phd的这个training.....你还有一年就要拿到phD了,你也很确定自己的兴趣不在此,我要是你,就从现在开始自学所有quant相关的知识,一边做完这个phd....等你毕业的时候或毕业前就开始找这方面的位置。不在乎你有没有FE的学位,如果你知识过硬,headhunter自然会给你找到interview

再去读个finanical engineering的master一来开销太大,二来又要耽误你至少1年的时间,三来你之前付出的phd的辛苦也白费了。。。。

其实我跟mm的处境很像,不过我一直很拖拉,一直到毕业了也没有看多少quant方面的书,现在开始找这方面的工作很吃力。不过我给自己一年的时间,如果还不成的话,我想也会去考虑读个financial engineering的master........

mm,拥抱拥抱 [em07]


我听FE得master和我说 市场对Phd的需求量不是很大,所以拿到Phd反而面试机会不多。


倒是Master 和小本 得面试 offer都很好拿。。。。。


所以我才考虑放弃Phd的, 因为并不是拿到Phd就更好找。。。。。

[em03][em03][em03]
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